Cile: tribunale revoca accuse alla famiglia di Pinochet

[Ronnie]

Guarda che ho postato appositamente wikipedia, che si sa, vale solo per una ricerca approssimativa...
La famiglia che conosci a sua volta magari l'aveva rubata nel vero senso della parola...

Mosongo senti, vuoi che ti posti l'elenco di violazioni Costituzionali delle quali si rese responsabile il Presidente del Chile Allende? Se vuoi posso postare un documento incontestabile: l'atto con cui il parlamento cileno su denuncia della corte suprema del Cile condannò l'operato di Allende chiedendo che tornasse nella legalità o che intervenisse l'esercito.

No perchè magari non hai capito che Allende fece in 3 anni probabilmente peggio che Pinochet in trenta.

Forse ti sarà utile anche leggere i commenti del The Economist:



The end of Allende

[Editorial, The Economist, September 15, 1973]

The temporary death of democracy in Chile will be regrettable, but the blame lies clearly with Dr. Allende and those of his followers who persistently overrode the constitution.

President Allende did not become a martyr, even if it is true that he took his own life on Tuesday. The bombing and storming of his presidential palace and the seizure of power by the commanders of Chile's armed forces put a bitter end to the first freely-elected marxist government in the west.

And the fighting may have barely begun. With most of Chile's links with the outside world still severed, it was difficult to take the full measure of the apparently continuing violence. But if a bloody civil war does ensue, or if the generals who have now seized power decide not to hold new elections, there must be no confusion about where the responsibility for Chile's tragedy lies. It lies with Dr. Allende and those in the marxist parties who pursued a strategy for the seizure of total power to the point at which the opposition despaired of being able to restrain them by constitutional means.

What happened in Santiago is not an everyday Latin American coup. The armed forces had tolerated Dr. Allende for nearly three years. In that time, he managed to plunge the country into the worst social and economic crisis in its modern history. The confiscation of private farms and factories caused an alarming slump in production, and the losses in state-run industries were officially admitted to have exceeded $1 billion last year. Inflation rose to 350 per cent over the past twelve months. Small businessmen were bankrupted; civil servants and skilled workers saw their salaries whittled away by inflation; housewives had to queue endlessly for basic foods, when they were available at all. The mounting desperation caused the major strike movement that the truck-drivers started six weeks ago.

But the Allende government did more than wreck the economy. It violated both the letter and the spirit of the constitution. The way it rode roughshod over congress and the courts eroded faith in the country's democratic institutions.

A resolution passed by the opposition majority in congress last month declared that "the government is not merely responsible for isolated violations of the law and the constitution; it has made them into a permanent system of conduct." The feeling that parliament had been made irrelevant was increased by violence in the streets (almost on a Belfast scale) and by the way the government tolerated the growth of armed groups on the far left that were openly preparing for civil war.

The armed forces moved only when it had long been clear that there was a popular mandate for military intervention. They had to move in the end because all constitutional means had failed to restrain a government that was behaving unconstitutionally.

The trigger for the coup was provided by the efforts of left-wing extremists to promote subversion within the armed forces. Two leaders of Dr. Allende's Popular Unity coalition, Sir Carlos Altamirano, the former Socialist party secretary-general, and Sir Oscar Garreton of the Movement of United Popular Action, were named by the navy as the "intellectual authors" of plans for mutiny among the sailors at Valparaiso. The Valparaiso naval commanders were the first to move this week. But the rapid success of the coup and the participation in it of all the armed forces (including the paramilitary carabineros) suggest that the plans for it had been carefully laid. It remains to be seen whether the armed forces are now solid in their opposition to the ousted government. The disappearance of two commanders, Admiral Raul Montero and General Sepulveda, the carabineros' chief, who were replaced by their anti-marxist subordinates on the day of the coup, shows that not all senior officers were in favor of it.

The real danger of bloodshed will come if the armed forces split, or if there are serious mutinies among the lower ranks. That could produce a messy civil war. Strong resistance can be expected from the workers' committees and paramilitary brigades that the Socialist party and the movement of the Revolutionary Left are running in Santiago and from guerilla groups in the south. But if they fail to get significant military backing, they can probably be contained.

Whatever government emerges from the coup cannot expect an easy time. There will also be a temptation now for those who have suffered from the Allende government to settle their accounts with the defeated side. Few people believe that Chile can now return to its old way of doing things.

The work of reconstruction will involve considerable sacrifice, just as it did in Brazil when Senhor Roberto Campos was responsible for economic planning in the years after the 1964 coup. This does not mean that Chile will become another Brazil; for one thing, it's probably a less violent place even now, and for another its generals have a rather different conception of the role from the soldiers behind Senhor Campos. They accept that it is too late to reverse many of the changes brought about by Dr. Allende; in trying to rebuild the private sector, for instance, they will lay more stress on coaxing back foreign investors and on creating new industries than on handing back what was taken away.

General Pinochet and his fellow officers are no one's pawns. Their coup was home-grown, and attempts to make out that the Americans were involved are absurd to those who know how wary they have been in their recent dealings with Chile.

The military-technocratic government that is apparently emerging will try to knit together the social fabric that the Allende government tore apart.

It will mean the temporary death of democracy in Chile, and that is to be deplored. But it must not be forgotten who made it inevitable.

http://www.josepinera.com/pag/pag_tex_endallende.htm


--------------

ricapitolando:

1- Allende era un dittatore Marxista, le forze armate hanno salvato il paese da una tirannia

2- i marxisti di regola fanno morti a milioni, dove prendono il potere, mentre i militari di morti in Cile ne hanno fatti TREMILA (un terzo degli incidenti stradali in un anno in italia) in trenta anni.

quindi il motivo dell'eliminazione di quei tremila tra cui il Dr. Salvador Allende è -crudo e brutale- il seguente: sarebbe stato peggio non farlo.

Detto questo TU SAI COME TORNO' LA DEMOCRAZIA IN CILE? (e voglio una risposta)

[mosongo]

Mosongo senti, vuoi che ti posti l'elenco di violazioni Costituzionali delle quali si rese responsabile il Presidente del Chile Allende? Se vuoi posso postare un documento incontestabile: l'atto con cui il parlamento cileno su denuncia della corte suprema del Cile condannò l'operato di Allende chiedendo che tornasse nella legalità o che intervenisse l'esercito.

No perchè magari non hai capito che Allende fece in 3 anni probabilmente peggio che Pinochet in trenta.

Forse ti sarà utile anche leggere i commenti del The Economist:



The end of Allende

[Editorial, The Economist, September 15, 1973]

The temporary death of democracy in Chile will be regrettable, but the blame lies clearly with Dr. Allende and those of his followers who persistently overrode the constitution.

President Allende did not become a martyr, even if it is true that he took his own life on Tuesday. The bombing and storming of his presidential palace and the seizure of power by the commanders of Chile's armed forces put a bitter end to the first freely-elected marxist government in the west.

And the fighting may have barely begun. With most of Chile's links with the outside world still severed, it was difficult to take the full measure of the apparently continuing violence. But if a bloody civil war does ensue, or if the generals who have now seized power decide not to hold new elections, there must be no confusion about where the responsibility for Chile's tragedy lies. It lies with Dr. Allende and those in the marxist parties who pursued a strategy for the seizure of total power to the point at which the opposition despaired of being able to restrain them by constitutional means.

What happened in Santiago is not an everyday Latin American coup. The armed forces had tolerated Dr. Allende for nearly three years. In that time, he managed to plunge the country into the worst social and economic crisis in its modern history. The confiscation of private farms and factories caused an alarming slump in production, and the losses in state-run industries were officially admitted to have exceeded $1 billion last year. Inflation rose to 350 per cent over the past twelve months. Small businessmen were bankrupted; civil servants and skilled workers saw their salaries whittled away by inflation; housewives had to queue endlessly for basic foods, when they were available at all. The mounting desperation caused the major strike movement that the truck-drivers started six weeks ago.

But the Allende government did more than wreck the economy. It violated both the letter and the spirit of the constitution. The way it rode roughshod over congress and the courts eroded faith in the country's democratic institutions.

A resolution passed by the opposition majority in congress last month declared that "the government is not merely responsible for isolated violations of the law and the constitution; it has made them into a permanent system of conduct." The feeling that parliament had been made irrelevant was increased by violence in the streets (almost on a Belfast scale) and by the way the government tolerated the growth of armed groups on the far left that were openly preparing for civil war.

The armed forces moved only when it had long been clear that there was a popular mandate for military intervention. They had to move in the end because all constitutional means had failed to restrain a government that was behaving unconstitutionally.

The trigger for the coup was provided by the efforts of left-wing extremists to promote subversion within the armed forces. Two leaders of Dr. Allende's Popular Unity coalition, Sir Carlos Altamirano, the former Socialist party secretary-general, and Sir Oscar Garreton of the Movement of United Popular Action, were named by the navy as the "intellectual authors" of plans for mutiny among the sailors at Valparaiso. The Valparaiso naval commanders were the first to move this week. But the rapid success of the coup and the participation in it of all the armed forces (including the paramilitary carabineros) suggest that the plans for it had been carefully laid. It remains to be seen whether the armed forces are now solid in their opposition to the ousted government. The disappearance of two commanders, Admiral Raul Montero and General Sepulveda, the carabineros' chief, who were replaced by their anti-marxist subordinates on the day of the coup, shows that not all senior officers were in favor of it.

The real danger of bloodshed will come if the armed forces split, or if there are serious mutinies among the lower ranks. That could produce a messy civil war. Strong resistance can be expected from the workers' committees and paramilitary brigades that the Socialist party and the movement of the Revolutionary Left are running in Santiago and from guerilla groups in the south. But if they fail to get significant military backing, they can probably be contained.

Whatever government emerges from the coup cannot expect an easy time. There will also be a temptation now for those who have suffered from the Allende government to settle their accounts with the defeated side. Few people believe that Chile can now return to its old way of doing things.

The work of reconstruction will involve considerable sacrifice, just as it did in Brazil when Senhor Roberto Campos was responsible for economic planning in the years after the 1964 coup. This does not mean that Chile will become another Brazil; for one thing, it's probably a less violent place even now, and for another its generals have a rather different conception of the role from the soldiers behind Senhor Campos. They accept that it is too late to reverse many of the changes brought about by Dr. Allende; in trying to rebuild the private sector, for instance, they will lay more stress on coaxing back foreign investors and on creating new industries than on handing back what was taken away.

General Pinochet and his fellow officers are no one's pawns. Their coup was home-grown, and attempts to make out that the Americans were involved are absurd to those who know how wary they have been in their recent dealings with Chile.

The military-technocratic government that is apparently emerging will try to knit together the social fabric that the Allende government tore apart.

It will mean the temporary death of democracy in Chile, and that is to be deplored. But it must not be forgotten who made it inevitable.

http://www.josepinera.com/pag/pag_tex_endallende.htm


--------------

ricapitolando:

1- Allende era un dittatore Marxista, le forze armate hanno salvato il paese da una tirannia

2- i marxisti di regola fanno morti a milioni, dove prendono il potere, mentre i militari di morti in Cile ne hanno fatti TREMILA (un terzo degli incidenti stradali in un anno in italia) in trenta anni.

quindi il motivo dell'eliminazione di quei tremila tra cui il Dr. Salvador Allende è -crudo e brutale- il seguente: sarebbe stato peggio non farlo.

Detto questo TU SAI COME TORNO' LA DEMOCRAZIA IN CILE? (e voglio una risposta)

W Allende, W il Chile, Abbasso gli sfruttatori e ladroni che fanno le leggi capestro per salvare il loro culo e la ricchezza rubata ai poveri...e poi, quando viene un Presidente che vuole ridare al popolo la ricchezza che gli è lecita, si coinvolgono le leggi che i ricchi stessi hanno costruito per loro su misura!
W LA LUCHA POR UN MONDO MEJOR!!!
HASTA SIEMPRE ALLENDE!!

[Ronnie]

W Allende, W il Chile, Abbasso gli sfruttatori e ladroni che fanno le leggi capestro per salvare il loro culo e la ricchezza rubata ai poveri...e poi, quando viene un Presidente che vuole ridare al popolo la ricchezza che gli è lecita, si coinvolgono le leggi che i ricchi stessi hanno costruito per loro su misura!
W LA LUCHA POR UN MONDO MEJOR!!!
HASTA SIEMPRE ALLENDE!!

buonanotte...

Vedi che ho fatto bene a farti l'ultima domanda?

Detto questo TU SAI COME TORNO' LA DEMOCRAZIA IN CILE? (e voglio una risposta)

Mi basta la tua "non risposta", fatta per slogan Cheguevarastyle , a demolire tutta la tua posizione.
La democrazia in Cile tornò perchè Pinochet, come parte del piano per il ritorno alla democrazia del Cile elaborato dal suo governo, sottopose il suo mandato a due referendum. Quando perse il secondo si ritirò, e tornò la democrazia.

Appunto: Pinochet ha salvato il Cile da Allende, non lo ha distrutto, anzi lo ha spontaneamente riportato alla democrazia "quando il popolo ha scelto di tornarvi", dopo trenta anni di governo straordinariamente mite (per una dittatura) durante i quali l'economia cilena e il benessere del popolo (di TUTTO il popolo) sono cresciuti in tutti gli standard portando il Cile in vetta all'america latina.

[mosongo]

buonanotte...

Vedi che ho fatto bene a farti l'ultima domanda?
Mi basta la tua "non risposta", fatta per slogan Cheguevarastyle , a demolire tutta la tua posizione.
La democrazia in Cile tornò perchè Pinochet, come parte del piano per il ritorno alla democrazia del Cile elaborato dal suo governo, sottopose il suo mandato a due referendum. Quando perse il secondo si ritirò, e tornò la democrazia.

Appunto: Pinochet ha salvato il Cile da Allende, non lo ha distrutto, anzi lo ha spontaneamente riportato alla democrazia "quando il popolo ha scelto di tornarvi", dopo trenta anni di governo straordinariamente mite (per una dittatura) durante i quali l'economia cilena e il benessere del popolo (di TUTTO il popolo) sono cresciuti in tutti gli standard portando il Cile in vetta all'america latina.

La risposta già te l'avevo data al mio primo post di questo thread: ma te la riassumo grosso modo!
Bachelet è il contentino dato ai cileni per la parvenza democratica di un paese ormai irrimediabilmente distrutto nella sua economia statale che con l'assassinio Allende ha perso la sua ragione di esistere per una socialità democratica.

[Ronnie]

La risposta già te l'avevo data al mio primo post di questo thread: ma te la riassumo grosso modo!
Bachelet è il contentino dato ai cileni per la parvenza democratica di un paese ormai irrimediabilmente distrutto nella sua economia statale che con l'assassinio Allende ha perso la sua ragione di esistere per una socialità democratica.

queste sono frasi da comunista
proponi il suicidio collettivo del cile se non ha più senso di esistere

io credo che il comunismo di allende sarebbe stato la morte di alcuni MILIONI non MIGLIAIA di cileni. Poi affari tuoi le ideologie con le quali vuoi flirtare.

[mosongo]

queste sono frasi da comunista
proponi il suicidio collettivo del cile se non ha più senso di esistere

io credo che il comunismo di allende sarebbe stato la morte di alcuni MILIONI non MIGLIAIA di cileni. Poi affari tuoi le ideologie con le quali vuoi flirtare.

Stai facendo un corso per vendite online tipo quelle che ci ha abituati Wanna Marchi e Gurù?...Magari segui un corso dal Mago di Forcella, impari prima a vedere il futuro!

[nordista]

Stai facendo un corso per vendite online tipo quelle che ci ha abituati Wanna Marchi e Gurù?...Magari segui un corso dal Mago di Forcella, impari prima a vedere il futuro!

No, si chiama esperienza o statistica: TUTTI i governi comunisti per sopravvivere hanno dovuto eliminare democrazia e avversari (fisicamente).
Perche' il Cile sarebbe stato L'UNICO differente? Quale mago di sinistra hai consultato tu?

-N-

[mosongo]

No, si chiama esperienza o statistica: TUTTI i governi comunisti per sopravvivere hanno dovuto eliminare democrazia e avversari (fisicamente).
Perche' il Cile sarebbe stato L'UNICO differente? Quale mago di sinistra hai consultato tu?

-N-

Quello sinistro della CIA!!

[vota dc]

giù le mani dalla famiglia Pinochet
hanno già sofferto abbastanza per la morte del Generale

Ma che c'entra?Giù le mani perchè non c'entrano nulla piuttosto,mica erano come i figli di Saddam.Allende era un pazzo MASSONE che voleva nazionalizzare tutto in nome della sua religione,ma la nipote giustamente la lasciano girare il mondo in santa pace...vogliono mica perseguitare pure lei per par condicio?