Free Catalonia - Catalunya Lliure

[catalanet]

Buone a tutti,

Prima di tutto voglio dire che excusa per il mio italiano, non lo parlo e non lo scrivo bene. Io ho visto che stai parlando de la vostra lingua, io sono della Catalonia. Non che si voi sapere che cosa è, siamo una nazione oprimita entre l'Spagna e la France. La nostra principale causa è arrivare a l'independentzia ma in questo memento non è possibile perchè non siamo gli sufficiente gente per votare SI nel referendum.

Sono da Catalonia, una nazione europea è situata all'Est del Penisola Iberica. Lo Stato Spagnolo, lo Stato Francese e il mare mediterraneo sono i confini continental di Catalunya. Di fronte alla costa Valencian, troviamo che le isole Baleari chiamavano Insular Catalunya.
Catalunya ha un aera di 69.823 km2, di conseguenza è più grande che Albania, Belgio, Danimarca, Olanda, Lussemburgo o Svizzera.
Ai nostri giorni, ha 11 abitanti di millon in diretta su ciò.

Catalunya ha segnato caratteristiche nazionali non solamente storico e culturale altro che quelli anche linguistici

La nostra lingua è parlata per quasi 11 milioni di persone, la lingua di Malta (maltese) solo è parlato per 300.000, la sua è oficciale i la nostra (il catalan) NO!


Non è credibilie ma è vero.

Excussa una altra volta per il mio italiano, si non capisquere il mio italiano, la proxima volta escriviré in lingua inglesa o in lingua catalana che è fazile di capire.

Grazie mile per il vostro tempo.

Una domanda, c'è qualcuno che parla catalan,
qualche alghuerese?



Per piú informazione di Catalunya/Catalonia visit gli web:



WWW.CATALUNYALLIUREJA.TK o www.freecatalonia.com

Grazie mile a tuti e salute!

Gracies a tots i salutacions des de Catalunya

[Mitteleuropeo]

Ciao Catalanet,

per non offenderti, non ti rispondo in spagnolo, ma in italiano .

Una domanda tecnica: da voi Margall si e' presentato nella coalizione EFA (European Free Alliance). Era il solo partito Catalano affiliato?

Ci puoi postare i risultati delle Europee in Catalunya, per favore?


Grazie e saluti

[catalanet]

Ciao Mitteleuropeo,

Grazie per non rispondere in spagnolo

Credo che la risposta a la tua domanda de si Maragall è de la EFA, devo dirti che non è vero.

Il partito catalano che è afiliato alla AFE è ERC (Esquerra Repúblicana de Catalunya - Sinistra Republicana di Catalunya, è il partito che cerca la independèntzia di Catalunya)



EFA web site

PSC (Sosialista il partito di Maragall)
997.311 eleccions anteriors
898.491 2004
- 98.820

PP (Partito populare, distra spagnola)
486.471 eleccions anteriors
372.905 2004
- 113.566

En el cas dels partits nacionals:

eleccions anteriors i les del 2004
CIU (nazionalista catalani)
843.021
365.961
- 477.060

ERC (independentista catalani)
174.374
248.263
+ 73.889

ICV (sinistra verde)
(156.471+58.977)
150.925
- 64.523

Tu non dovrebbe vedere questo risultati, perché le elezioni europee sono molto diferenti e molta gente non votavano (quasi 60 %).
Tu dovrebbe vedere le ultime elezioni, lo spanish o il catalan Parlament nazionale in cui le persone andavano a voto. E alhora alla elezione europee i gruppi politici vanno sempre con un altro gruppi politici, e ci sono molte coalizioni tra loro.

PSC: vots a les eleccions parlament Catalunya: 1.031.454
vots a les eleccions europees: 898.491

PP: vots a les eleccions parlament Catalunya: 393.499
vots a les eleccions europees: 372.905

ERC: vots a les eleccions parlament Catalunya: 544.324

vots a les eleccions europees: 248.263
en les espanyoles 652.196)

CIU: 958.879
en les espanyoles 843.021
365.961 a les europees.

[Mitteleuropeo]

Catalanet, grazie per i dati. Se ho capito bene, l' ERC ha avuto un aumento di voti in Catalunya rispetto alle precedenti Europee, ma evidentemente su una percentuale bassa di votanti, molto piu' bassa che alle elezioni Nazionali.

Perchè consideri l' ERC come Partito Nazionale (a differenza di Margall)? Forse e' alleato nel territorio del Regno di Spagna con qualcun' altro?

Nel governo centrale Catalano, ERC sostiene o si oppone a PSC?

Approfitto della tua cortesia, perche' l' argomento mi interessa molto, anche dato che sono spesso per lavoro a Barcelona.

Saluti

[catalanet]

Originally posted by Mitteleuropeo


Perchè consideri l' ERC come Partito Nazionale (a differenza di Margall)? Forse e' alleato nel territorio del Regno di Spagna con qualcun' altro?

Nel governo centrale Catalano, ERC sostiene o si oppone a PSC?

Approfitto della tua cortesia, perche' l' argomento mi interessa molto, anche dato che sono spesso per lavoro a Barcelona.

Saluti

Ciao Mitteleuropeo,

Respondré en català i en anglès perquè em serà més fàcil i escriuré més ràpid. Si tu o algú no entén alguna paraula o algú, només ha de dir-m'ho i jo ho traduiré.

ERC és un partit nacional i independentista de Catalunya i dels Països Catalans i en Maragall, el PSC, està unit amb el PSOE (Partit Socialista Obrer Espanyol).

ERC sosté al govern nacional català al PSC i també a Espanya vota a favor seu a vegades. Hi ha també CIU que és nacionalista català i ha estat al govern català durant 23 anys, però ara tenim un govern catalanista i d'esquerres. També tenim el PP(Aznar), ultra nacionalista espanyol i quasi feixista. Que ha governat a Espanya els últims i llargs 8 anys.

Salutacions.
----------------------------------------------
I will answer you in catalan and in english because it will be more easy for me and I'll write it more quick.If you or anybody doesn't understand some word or something, just have to tell me it and I'll try to translate.

ERC is a national and independentist political group of Catalonia and the Catalan Countries, Maragall and the PSC goes togheter with PSOE.

ERC is in the Catalan National government with PSC and also in Spain votes sometimes with PSOE. There is also CIU that is catalan nationalist and has been in the catalan government for 23 years, but now we have a catalanist and left government. Also there is PP (Aznar) ultra nacionalist spanish party and almost fascist. Has been in the spanish government the last and long 8 years.

Best regards.

[Mitteleuropeo]

Thanks, Catalanet, for the information. So, I understand that in the present left-wing, Catalanist Government, there is an alliance between ERC and Margall, which on the Territory of the Kingdom of Spain, is also extended to the PSOE (formerly Gonzalez, now Zapatero).
So, it was not far fetched, when I wrote, time ago, that Margall is linked to EFA: he is somehow linked, but through an allied Party.

That supports my view, that Federalism and Autonomy are not necessarliy linked with right or left: it depends on the convenience and on the contents of the alliance.

My mayor concern is seeing that the Lega Nord is approaching an alliance for ever with definitely right-wing Parties, who do not pursuit the same goals as those in view of which Lega Nord was born.

When I was last time in Barcelona, I was told by some business friends that "Es bueno que Pujol no sigua en la política: no ha hecho nada bueno para Cataluña y nosotros tenemos que defendernos de los Españoles".
On the contrary, when I visit Barcelona, I am impressed by the increasing Catalan identity and by the increase of the utilization of the Catalan Language, also for formal communication. Unfortunately, I cannot speak it, so that I must go ahead with Spanish. Sorry!

The opposite is true in Northern Italy: with time people get more and more accustomed to Southern habits and language.

CU!

[catalanet]

That supports my view, that Federalism and Autonomy are not necessarliy linked with right or left: it depends on the convenience and on the contents of the alliance.

Si, Jo absolutament estic d'acord amb la teva opinió, encara que Jo crec que els partits d'esquerra normalment haurien de intentar de millorar o canviar més les coses, això significa que els partits polítics d'esquerra haurien de ser qui aconseguissin més millores.Perquè, segons la meva opinió, els partits polítics d'esquerra són conservadors, per tant no els agrada gaire els canvis.

Sobre Catalunya jo diria que sempre podria ser millor. La única llengua natural de Catalunya és el català, però durant els darrers 40 anys o més, la immigració espanyola ha vingut i molts d'ells no volen aprendre el nostre idioma. Fins i tot quan els és necessari per a treballar, he de dir també que quan Franco era el líder dels espanyols els catalans no podíem parlar i escriure en el nostre idioma. El temps ha canviat i potser Catalunya ha millorat però tot podria ser millor.

Per exemple la situació del català a Europa, on és parlat per 11 milions de ciutadans i no és un idioma oficial a Europa. Som la setena comunitat lingüística de la Unió Europea en termes demogràfics(i la més gran sense estructures d'Estat).Existeixen Parlaments, institucions públiques,escoles i universitats, diaris, televisions, mitjans de comunicació, molts llibres escrits i publicats en català, una important presència al www, profesionals, companyies i organitzacions que utilitzen sempre el català, evidentment a part de la població. (amb una diferent quantitat i qualitat en tota la presència del territori)

T'aconsello aquest enllaç per a més informació:Catalan in Europe

He vist que parles algunes llengües i tens força coneixença del què succeeix a Catalunya i a Espanya. És interessant perquè normalment no hi ha gent amb aquests coneixements. Ho sento però jo no conec molt la situació del teu país, sé que hi han algunes parts que estàn intentant aconseguir la independència, em podries explicar una mica quina és la situació política d'Italia i quins són els moviments polítics, siusplau?


Moltes gràcies.Atentament.
--------------------------------------

Yes, I absolutly agree with you about your opinion, although I think that left usualy should try to improve or change more the things, so it means that political left groups should be who get more improvements.Because, in my opinion, right political groups are conservatives, so they don't like too much changes.

About Catalonia I would say that always could be better. The only natural language is catalan, but for the last 40 years or more, spanish immigration has come here and lots of them don't want to learn this language. Even when they need the language to work, I must say too, that when Franco was the spansih leader we couldn't speak and write our language. Times has changed and maybe Catalonia has improved but all could be better.

For example the situation of catalan in Europe, where is spoken by 11 milion of citizens and it is not an official language in Europe.We are the seventh language community of Union in demographic terms (and the greatest without state structures). There are Parliaments, public institutions, schools and universities, radio, television, newspapers, journals, original books and translations, an important presence in the world wide web, professionals, enterprises and organizations that express themselves normally in Catalan (with a different qualitative and quantitative presence in the different territories).
I advice you this link:
Catalan in Europe


I have seen you speak some languages and also you know quite good catalan and spanish situation. It's interesting because normally there is no people with this knowknowledges.
I'm really sorry but I don't know very good the situation of your country, I know a little bit that there are some parts that are trying to get the independence. Could you explain me a bit wich is the political situation of Italia, and their political movements please?

Thanks very much.

[Mitteleuropeo]

i]Originally posted by catalanet [/i]
Could you explain me a bit wich is the political situation of Italia, and their political movements please?

Thanks very much.

* It is the easiest question on earth!

I'll try to keep it short and the least one-sided as possible, but must begin stating that I belong for one-half to a German-speaking and for the other half to a Ladinian- speaking minority within the Territory of the Italian Republic, which I personally regard as a State occupying foreign Territories, maybe, as you will regard Spain.

So, in short:

1. Italy's parties are divided mainly into two blocks:

1.1. Casa delle Liberta' (CdL), right-wing, now at the Government, composed by Forza Italia (the party materially owned by Premier Berlusconi, the richest man in Italy, extremely capitalistic and strongly linked to G.W.Bush, Alleanza nazionale, former fascists who have allegedly changed their beliefs in order to be more readily acceptable for alliances and for public charges, UDC, former Christian-Democratics, looking for an identity and, much to my regret, Lega Nord.
This Party, founded by its charismatic Leader Umberto Bossi, has had the enormous merit to raise in the conscience of Northerners that they were completely different from Southeners, had their own culture, based on Celtic rather than on Latin roots and thus it was impossible to share the same laws. Proposals from the Lega Nord went from a Federalism up to overt secession, possibly in a democratic way. In the first times, when it received about 10% of votes, Lega Nord declared not to belong neither to the Right nor to tle Left. When they joined the Government headed by berlusconi, they were obliged to turn to the right and to dilute their historical claim for Federalism or Secession. The convenience of having made this choice is still a matter for discussion, see Forum PADANIA and ETNONAZIONALISMO.

1.2. Ulivo. This coalition, also made of different souls, pools together Margherita, a moderate middle-left group, Democratici di Sinistra (DS), the followers of former Communist Party, having undergone more or less the same cosmetic changes as the fascists of AN and Comunisti Italiani, a strange so-called democratic party, whose predident, Diliberto, former Minister of Justice, went to the Rome Airport to welcome Ms. Baraldini, sentenced in the US to life-long imprisonment for terrorism

2. There are also minor Parties, which it would be too time-consuming and not extremely useful to describe.

The main problems faced by the Italian politics is the conflict of private and public interests of Mr. Berlusconi, his failure to obtain significant improvements on the real problems of the Country (public finance, research, employment, price-control, federal changes to the Costitutional Chart), opposed to the absolute lack of persons and ideas in the left wing of Italy's political world.

My personal behaviour is to support any Party wanting to put the utmost distance between Trieste (+ Udine) and Rome (+ Mafia-dominated Sicily ).

CU !

[catalanet]

Moltes gràcies per la informació que has explicat sobre la política italiana. Si vols saber quelcom més sobre Catalunya, els Països Catalans o qualsevol qüestió política, només has de preguntar-ho.

Fins a la pròxima vegada.

Thank you very much for the information you explained about the italian politic. If you want to know something more about Catalonia, Catalan Countries or some political question, you just have to ask me it.

See you next time.

[Biordo]

Una petita i indenspensable integraciò:

la lega nord segueix parlant de "padania", un estat che mai va existir i que no té ni una llengua comù ni una historia comù.

la le lega nord va inventar una senyera (que té més o menys 10 ans) i una identitat celtica anti-latina que fer riure a els 95% dels italians.

Aixì la lega nord serveix el centralisme de Roma molt bé ofegant amb la ridicula "padania" totes les veritables identitas históricas del estat italià.

Perdona el meu Català, saluts!!!