Mi state assassinando!!!!!!!

[antoninus]

Sono contro la Pena di morte americana
Sono contro la Pena di morte di Cuba dell'Iran e della Cina
E adesso cosa ha da dirci signor AM?

E` quella praticata dal Che?

[antoninus]

Allucinante, come sempre l'americano medio e' sempre pronto a giustificare gli eccidi di casa propria con delle false bugie.
.................................................. ................

Non ho giustificato l'invasione dell'Iraq.

Viva il Che? Quindi, approvi la pena di morte praticata da Ernesto Guevara?

[antoninus]

si sbaglia di grosso!!
VIVA GLI USA !
GLI USA sig. Flenzi non sono solo BUSH!! MENTRE CUBA E' SOLO FIDEL DA UN BEL PO'

Esatto!

[FLenzi]

Per un Flenzi che "condanna" la pena di morte e porta la maglietta del boia Che.

Non mi risulta che Guevara fosse un boia, ma agli AM gli usa fanno credere l'impossibile, senno come farebbero a reclutare poveri imbecilli che vanno a morire in nome dell'impero.
Mi fa qusi pena nella sua dabbedaggine a sostenere l'insostenibile.

[FLenzi]

Il tuo anti-cristianesimo, il tuo ovvio odio verso i cristiani (e anche verso gli americani) non ti fa onore.

Cosa ti distingue fra un nazista o un KKK?

Io nono odio nessuno, tan'e' vero che non ho mai appoggiato le guerre come avete fatto voi luridi assassini, io non odio gli americani, io non sopporto gli americani medi, quelli come lei che non hanno un minimo di cervello ma solo faccia tosta di venire a parlare su un forum cercando di nascondere le nefandezze di quel paese.

[antoninus]

Non mi risulta che Guevara fosse un boia, ma agli AM gli usa fanno credere l'impossibile, senno come farebbero a reclutare poveri imbecilli che vanno a morire in nome dell'impero.
Mi fa qusi pena nella sua dabbedaggine a sostenere l'insostenibile.

Non ti risulta?

E` un fatto storico. Per esempio, ha personalmente "giustiziato" un ragazzo colpevole di avere fame (ha rubato un pezzo di pane). Ma questo l'ho
gia` postato con altro-- non ti risulta perche` non vuoi accettare la verita`.....

Infatti, al Che piaceva la pena di morte e anche le armi nucleari........

In fact Che went about turning volunteer bands of guerrillas into a classic Army, with strict discipline and hierarchy. As he himself wrote: "Due to the lack of discipline among the new men... it was necessary to establish a rigid discipline, organise a high command and set up a Staff". He demanded the death penalty for "informers, insubordinates, malingerers and deserters". He himself personally carried out executions. Indeed the first execution carried out against an informer by the Castroists was undertaken by Che. He wrote: "I ended the problem giving him a shot with a .32 pistol in the right side of the brain". On another occasion he planned on shooting a group of guerrillas who had gone on hunger strike because of bad food. Fidel intervened to stop him. Another guerrilla who dared to question Che was ordered into battle without a weapon!

Apart from the drive towards militarisation in the guerrilla groups, Che also had another important duty. He acted as the main spreader of Stalinism within J26M. He secretly worked towards an alliance with the Popular Socialist Party (the Cuban Communist Party). Up to then there were very few Stalinists within J26M and other anti-Batista groups like the Directorate and the anarchists were staunchly anti-Stalinist. The communists were highly unpopular among the anti-Batista forces. They had been junior partners of the regime and had openly condemned Castro's previous attacks on Batista in 1953. They belatedly joined the guerrilla war.

With the Castroite victory in 1959, Che, along with his Stalinist buddy Raul Castro, was put in charge of building up state control. He purged the army, carried out re-education classes within it, and was supreme prosecutor in the executions of Batista supporters, 550 being shot in the first few months. He was seen as extremely ruthless by those who saw him at work. These killings against supporters of the old regime, some of whom had been implicated in torture and murder, was extended in 1960 to those in the working class movement who criticised the Castro regime. The anarchists and anarcho-syndicalists had their press closed down and many militants were thrown in prison. Che was directly implicated in this. This was followed in 1962 with the banning of the Trotskyists and the imprisonment of their militants. Che said: "You cannot be for the revolution and be against the Cuban Communist Party". He repeated the old lies against the Trots that they were agents of imperialism and provocateurs. He helped set up a secret police, the C-2 and had a key role in creating the Committees for the Defence of the Revolution, which were locally and regionally based bodies for spying on and controlling the mass of the population.

Missile Deal

Che was the main link, indeed the architect, of the increasingly closer relation between Cuba and the Soviet Union. The nuclear missile deal which almost resulted in a nuclear war in 1962 was engineered at the Cuban end by Che. When the Russians backed down in the face of US threats, Che was furious and said that if he had been in charge of the missiles, he would have fired them off!

By 1963, Che had realised that Russian Stalinism was a shambles after a visit to Russia where he saw the conditions of the majority of the people, this after "Soviet-style planning" in the Cuban economy had been pushed through by him. Instead of coming to some libertarian critique of Stalinism, he embraced Chinese Stalinism. He denounced the Soviet Union's policy of peaceful co-existence, which acknowledged that Latin America was the USA's backyard, and gave little or no support to any movement against American control. Fidel was now obsessed with saving the Cuban economy, himself arguing for appeasement. Against this Che talked about spreading armed struggle through Latin America, if necessary using nuclear war to help this come about!

Shambles

It was on this basis that Che left Cuba never to return. He went to the Congo, where he worked with the Congolese Liberation Army, supported by the Chinese Stalinists. This was a shambles of a campaign, and Che ended up isolated with many of his band dead. Despite this, Che still believed in guerrilla struggle waged by a tiny armed minority. His final, fatal, campaign was in Bolivia.

This also was a fiasco. Basing himself once more on old Castroist strategies, he failed to relate to the industrial working class. The Bolivian working class, and especially the tin miners, had a recent record of militancy and class consciousness. The peasants, on the other hand, among whom Che hoped to create an armed insurrection, had been demobilised by the land reforms of 1952. So, Che was unable to relate to either workers or peasants. The local Communist Party failed to support him. Robbed of support, Che was surrounded in the Andean foothills, captured and executed.

Yes, Che was very brave physically. Yes, he was single-mindedly devoted to what he saw as the revolution and socialism. Yes, he refused the privilege and luxury granted to other leaders of Castroist Cuba, taking an average wage and working hard in his various government jobs. But many militarists, fascists and religious fanatics share these characteristics of bravery and self-sacrifice. Che's good looks and 'martyr's' death turned him into an icon, an icon duly exploited by all those wanting to turn a fast buck selling 'revolutionary' chic.

But good looks and bravery camouflage what Che really was. A ruthless authoritarian and Stalinist, who expressed admiration for the Peronista authoritarian nationalists, Che acted as a willing tool of the Soviet bloc in spreading their influence. Even when he fell out with the USSR about the possibility of guerrilla war in Latin America, he still remained a convinced Stalinist with admiration for China and North Korea. He had no disagreements with the Soviets about what sort of society he wanted -a bureaucratic authoritarian state-capitalist set up with contempt for the masses.

Che may look like the archetypal romantic revolutionary. In reality he was a tool of the Stalinist power blocs and a partisan of nuclear war. His attitudes and actions reveal him to be no friend of the working masses, whether they be workers or peasants.

[antoninus]

Io nono odio nessuno, tan'e' vero che non ho mai appoggiato le guerre come avete fatto voi luridi assassini, io non odio gli americani, io non sopporto gli americani medi, quelli come lei che non hanno un minimo di cervello ma solo faccia tosta di venire a parlare su un forum cercando di nascondere le nefandezze di quel paese.

Non hai mai appoggiato le guerre? E la guerra del Che e Fidel contro Battista?

[antoninus]

"He demanded the death penalty for "informers, insubordinates, malingerers and deserters". He himself personally carried out executions. Indeed the first execution carried out against an informer by the Castroists was undertaken by Che. He wrote: "I ended the problem giving him a shot with a .32 pistol in the right side of the brain". On another occasion he planned on shooting a group of guerrillas who had gone on hunger strike because of bad food. Fidel intervened to stop him. Another guerrilla who dared to question Che was ordered into battle without a weapon!"

Personalmente giustiava i condannati. La prima esecuzione ordinata dai Castroisti fu eseguita dal Che. Il Che scrisse: "Ho messo fine al problema dandogli un colpo con una pistola del calibro .32 al lato destra del cervello."

Proprio come fanno adesso nella Repubblica Popolare di Cina.

[antoninus]

Per il Che, un reato. Sentenza: Muerte.

"On another occasion he planned on shooting a group of guerrillas who had gone on hunger strike because of bad food."

[antoninus]

Piaceva tanto la pena di morte al Che, che ogni tanto ci "giocava":

"En enero de 1957, como lo indica su diario de Sierra Maestra, Guevara mató a Eutimio Guerra porque sospechaba que estaba pasando información: "Acabé con el problema dándole un tiro con una pistola del calibre 32 en la sien derecha? Sus pertenencias pasaron a mi poder". Más tarde mató a Aristidio, un campesino que expresó el deseo de abandonar la causa cuando los rebeldes siguieron avanzando. Aunque se preguntó si esta víctima "era de verdad suficientemente culpable como para merecer la muerte", no tuvo reparos para ordenar la muerte de Echavarría, hermano de uno de sus camaradas, a causa de crímenes no especificados: "Tenía que pagar el precio". EN OTROS MOMENTOS SIMULOó EJECUCIONES SIN LLEVARLAS A CABO, COME método de TORTURA PSICOLOGICA."